Are You Staying Together for the Kids? Ask Yourself This First

[00:00:04] For me, the moment I finally made the decision was the question that popped into my head. What would you tell the girls if they came home and told you that this was the relationship that they were in? Wow. And from that moment forward, I knew exactly what needed to happen. So I share that question, right? I share that question with clients. Yes. I can't make the decision for you, but that might be helpful for you.

[00:00:32] We'd like to welcome you back to a wonderful episode of the Beyond I Do podcast. And y'all, we had a wonderful guest with us. It's like a friend, a family member, a mentor. She is just a delight.

[00:00:55] Professionally, she is the owner of Enduring Connections and Advocacy. She is a divorce coach, a relationship coach. She is a co-parenting coach and mediator. And she is very committed to helping families throughout conflict and in rough times to make sure that everyone involved comes out okay.

[00:01:22] And fun fact, she did the same coaching program that we did. And so that's how we got connected with each other. And she has been a doll. So she has helped us and we have helped her. So we are so looking forward to this interview. Yep. All right. So here we go.

[00:01:45] All right, Jennifer. So for listeners meeting you for the first time, who are you and what pulled you into this work? Ooh. So I'm Jennifer Struffert, the founder of Enduring Connections and Advocacy, where my mission is to help people to reduce conflict and increase connection in their lives.

[00:02:07] And I do that through a number of ways, through relationship coaching, through divorce coaching, domestic relations mediation, and also parenting coordination. So I get into a lot of conflict. All right. And try and resolve a lot of conflict, too. So the word conflict, that tends to have a very negative connotation. And sometimes people think that there isn't conflict in healthy relationship.

[00:02:37] But if you could explain to us like the, I mean, conflict happens. What's the difference between that ending in a positive way versus a negative way? Yeah. So in some of my work, it obviously has a more negative connotation. And I know in general, some people have a negative connotation with conflict, too. But there definitely can be positive conflict in relationships as well.

[00:03:05] So just because we have a difference of opinion doesn't mean that it needs to be a negative conversation or we need to approach it in a way that is disconnecting rather than connecting and trying to understand each other better.

[00:03:17] And I think that's a huge miss that people have is not taking the time to better understand the other person and getting more curious with them so that they can understand what the other person is thinking and feeling and experiencing so that they can learn from that and figure out the best way for them to move forward. And that concept, I feel like applies across the work that I have.

[00:04:06] And that's a huge issue. Look, we've learned to, we had to learn that we process those things differently.

[00:04:36] And so what I may have perceived as him like shutting down was actually him needing to process that by himself first and then come back to the table. So we tend to text or write things so that we give each other time to process through it because I'm feisty.

[00:04:59] And in the heat of things, I can say things just because we're in the heat of the moment that I don't mean, but I've, you know, gotten worked up and God forbid that happened over a misunderstanding when we could have just kind of slowed things down. So she's feisty and my brain works a little slower. I don't buy that. She's on question number five.

[00:05:28] And I'm still thinking about question number five. And I'm still thinking about question number two. And by the time she gets done talking, I don't know what question I'm on. So I have to just, you know, write it down or write, writing was my, my friend in our, in our earlier days, you know, before we didn't share a cell phone. Right. We shared a cell phone. We couldn't text them. All right.

[00:05:57] So showing up differently, you talk about the power of showing up differently. What does that look like in real situations? Yeah. Um, so one of the things that I challenge people to do is think about how they're contributing to the relationship, both positively and negatively. No one is perfect.

[00:06:16] And so through the work that I do, having an opportunity to really like dive a little bit more deeply into the way that we are communicating with one another and understanding like what are the positives I'm bringing and how am I improving our relationship? And then helping people with tools to help them move more in that direction.

[00:06:42] Because oftentimes we all have, I don't know, I feel like we all have had maybe negative influences at some point in time in our life or learned bad behaviors over time. And those bad behaviors have a tendency to creep into our relationships and right or wrong. Right. And I don't think that we intend to hurt anyone by those behaviors showing up. It's just something that we've perhaps normalized.

[00:07:07] And even though those behaviors might give a short term gain, they really do damage to our relationships in the long term. So helping people to understand, you know, and look at it from a different lens of how that might be perceived and help them with tools to show up and communicate with their partner in a different and new way that maybe they haven't tried before.

[00:07:33] What would change if you stop guessing and start building on purpose? If you love your partner, but feel disconnected, our book was written for you. Unlocking Forever breaks marriage down into real usable shifts. No fluff, no perfection. Just practical ways to build a marriage at last. You can grab it now. Check out the link in the show notes or the description.

[00:08:02] And until next time, we gonna holler at y'all. And in full disclosure, we did the same training program for relationship coaching. And that was one of the components that I liked about the program was the accountability piece. It's so easy to point fingers at each other and talk about what the other person is or is not doing.

[00:08:31] But honestly, we we're only accountable for our own actions. And so once you if if I as an individual look at my actions and how I'm contributing, be it positive or negative, and he does the same, then that's where the control is, because I can't control him. I've tried. Tell me how did that go. He's just hard headed.

[00:09:01] If he would just listen to me. But that was part of the what I liked about the program was the accountability piece and looking at, you know, how can what can I do to improve my relationship? So and I love that, like accountability piece and the self realization piece, because I also see oftentimes with couples when we start doing those types of activities, that there's more empathy that comes into the conversation as well.

[00:09:31] So the defenses kind of come down and they realize that their partner sees in themselves, maybe the qualities that they're seeing to experiencing. And then they're sharing their imperfections as well. And so it's like, oh, well, neither one of us is perfect. And we're both trying really hard. And now we know these things that are causing problems and we both want to work on them.

[00:09:57] And so I'd love when people show up ready to do the work and wanting to dive in and really change their relationship and embrace the tools. I want to back up a little bit and just ask you how you came to this point and you decided, you know, I want to to work with couples.

[00:10:25] I want to work with families who are experiencing these things. Yeah, absolutely. For me, it was based on my life experience. So I didn't have great relationship examples growing up. And, you know, you model what you see. And so for me, that's something that at one point in time I realized needed to change. And then for me, I had worked in corporate America for 20 years and my role was eliminated.

[00:10:55] My whole organization was eliminated. And so, you know, it gave me an opportunity to look at where I was going, what I was doing and what I wanted in my life. And for me, based on my experience, having, you know, separated, divorced, going through high conflict co-parenting, there was a lot that had happened. And that was really challenging and difficult.

[00:11:25] I manage it much better now. I had to do a lot of work on myself. I've done a lot of healing and a lot of growth. But for me, I wanted to help people going through that whole situation because, one, I wanted my girls to see positive examples of relationships, right? I wanted to have a great relationship. I want them to have great relationships. I have a great relationship now, which I love. Awesome.

[00:11:54] Yeah, it's a huge change. And I feel loved in a way that I've never felt before. And I feel like my relationships over all in my life have gotten a lot better having done this work. Right. Yeah, it's fantastic.

[00:12:12] And then, you know, when I went through my divorce, at least for the first, I don't know, two years at least, I didn't know about divorce coaches. And so for me, when I had a divorce coach, it made a huge difference. And so I knew the impact that it had on me, and I wanted to bring that to others.

[00:12:39] And along with that, I also wanted to provide other support services for people going through divorce. And so I also do the mediation element and parenting coordination.

[00:12:52] And I've personally been a client of all of the services that I provide, which I feel like differentiates me and what I bring to the table, because I have so much empathy for people that are going through, you know, needing a relationship coach or needing a divorce coach or sitting there during one of the most difficult times of your life, trying to work through mediation. Right. Which for me, it was gut-wrenching.

[00:13:22] But knowing how, having the relationship coaching skills that I can also bring to the table, along with the empathy that I have, having gone through it, I feel like I bring something to the couple that is going through that moment that is really helpful for them to not only calm and ground,

[00:13:49] but also just to know that it's okay to feel the way that they do. So they're not just a number to me. They're people that are going through a really hard time, and being able to understand that and sit there with them in that and still guide them forward in a meaningful way just feels really good to help people in that way.

[00:14:16] Right. And I'm sure a lot of people feel like there's a sense of failure. And so to have someone who is empathetic and compassionate to kind of guide you through that process, I know, makes a big difference in feeling supported and feeling like it's, you know, it's okay. We're going to get through it. Yeah. Especially with kids involved. For sure. I mean, and I've talked to friends who've gone through it as well, right?

[00:14:46] And they didn't have very pleasant mediation experiences. Like things were said to them that quite frankly made the situation worse. And, you know, hearing that is heartbreaking because you're already going through so much. And so if I can bring compassion to the table while also helping you to resolve it, that's, I think, a win for everyone. Right. Right.

[00:15:13] That has to be a pretty powerful of a task. Because when I think of divorce, I just think of two people just going at it about, you know, everything under the sun because both of them are hurt internally. But nobody wants to, you know, recognize it or admit it to each other. Yeah.

[00:15:36] But as far as the coaching side of divorcing, and I'm new to this, I've heard of it, the term. Yeah. Now, during your training, are there some things that you've learned and you adapted? And I think you said it before, but I just wanted to reiterate to the audience that you learn as you were training, like, man, I could have done this. I could have done that.

[00:16:06] Maybe I could have showed up different than I did. Have you had a lot of those moments? Yeah, for sure. I actually, I think it's helped me so much to go through the training that I've been through. So before I did the training, I did a lot of work on healing. I had a lot of trauma and things that I needed to figure out how to work through.

[00:16:27] And so, you know, having gone through that and then also going through the training, it was just a beautiful learning experience for me. And I love that I can then take what I've learned and bring that to other people and show them also that there's hope. Right. Because there are definitely points in the process for me where I felt like I had hit rock bottom.

[00:16:52] I didn't feel very hopeful, you know, wondering when things were going to end. You know, just feeling completely hopeless. And I don't feel like that anymore. Of course, there's hard moments. But the way that I show up and the way that I respond and the way that I've chosen to use the tools in my toolbox to help me so I am responding, not reacting.

[00:17:22] I like that. Yeah. Yeah. It's been really, really helpful. So we did an episode and there was an article about divorce. There were a thousand couples, I think, that had been they were divorced and they were interviewed.

[00:17:42] And one of the statistics from that article, 95% of those couples said that they believe if they had had support, strategies, tools, that they could have saved their marriage. And so with in your area of expertise, you have couples who are at this crisis level.

[00:18:07] Are you finding that those couples with the with the tools, with the strategies that they're able to do some repairing as opposed to continuing with the divorce, the divorce process? Yeah. So being really transparent, I haven't had anyone that's going through the divorce process that is looking to go back. Okay.

[00:18:31] But I think it's really important to note that the the couples that I see in relationship coaching that come in and they're struggling with things, watching them go through the tools and working with them and seeing those aha moments for them, like when they really get it. Yes. Yes. Oh, my gosh. It is like magic.

[00:18:56] And then seeing them light up as well and figure out, like, oh, my gosh, I've never seen that side of you before. I didn't know that. I really like that. And then asking each other why they haven't done this before. You haven't done it before because we've not been taught to do it. Right. Right. Right. We haven't been taught to do it. So don't feel bad. That's one of the right. Don't feel bad about it. But let's learn from it and figure out how to continue, like, building on this good thing that you have.

[00:19:25] So when when we went through the program, we like we're going through and we're doing all of the different activities and whatnot. And as we're talking to each other is I mean, we had been married at that point for 24, 25 years. And there was so much that we learned just going through, you know, the process together. And we realized that we had been through some of the things, but we didn't know what to name it. Right. We had language to catch too.

[00:19:55] What the tools were. We were just like, we had to figure it out. It's just a blessing to be able to see it right there on paper. Like, oh, OK, that's what that was. And to be able to go back and reference and use those things. So I'm going to I'm going to keep you. I'm going to keep you. I'll keep you. I'm happy to hear about it. Otherwise, we would be turning this into a coaching session today. Right.

[00:20:23] So many different episodes now. Can't bring anybody else up there. Well, I got a replacement. Well, it's just me. And a cardboard cutout. Yeah. So in terms of working with with the kids, when when kids are involved, how is that? How do you approach parents different when kids are involved?

[00:20:53] I was a kid of parents who needed to divorce. So how do you get the parents to understand that we need to work together on behalf of the kids? Yeah, that's a really great question. And my parents were very similar in that they probably should have divorced long before.

[00:21:18] So I think it's really helpful to talk to the parents about things from the child's perspective. It's so easy when you're caught up in conflict, just in general. Right. Like if you think about conflict you're in, just not involving your kids. It's so easy to get caught up in your side. Right. And them versus me.

[00:21:46] That you're not necessarily thinking about other things around and in that space. And so sometimes just pulling people back and helping them maybe calm down, too, because there's so many emotions involved. And helping them understand what that might look like from their child's perspective. Yeah.

[00:22:09] And honestly, that's a point where I feel like sometimes it's best actually to have the parents separate to do that conversation when it's really high conflict. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Then the walls can come down a little bit more, especially when you've got two feuding people and maybe they're constantly butting up against one another. Like trying to push them into a conversation like that.

[00:22:38] People can get standoffish and defensive. And so it's so much easier to have maybe a one-on-one during that time to help really focus in on what's truly important. I know.

[00:22:57] We've actually interviewed another therapist who works with couples who are, she calls herself crisis marriage therapy. Yeah. Something like that. Yeah. And I guess I tend to see things so black and white.

[00:23:16] It didn't occur to me until my friend was going through the divorce process that even though I know this is what I want, even though I know this is what's best for me, for my kids, there's still a grieving process. Um, so do you, have you supported couples or individuals who are in that stage trying to accept that, yes, this is what I wanted, but it's still, it's still hard. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[00:23:45] Like I was the one that filed for divorce. It was still hard. Mm-hmm. I don't know. When you get married, it's not your intent. You're not thinking about I'm going to get divorced. Right. Right. It's not your intent to do that. And so there's the loss of things that you've thought about, maybe you've hoped of, you've dreamed of throughout your life.

[00:24:10] And that whole dream, if you will, is now gone. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, it's a lot. Mm-hmm. Um, but helping people understand in that moment what they do have. Mm-hmm. Is really helpful.

[00:24:35] Um, and focusing on, you know, the positives that they might have, helping people with calming techniques and grounding so that they can come back to themselves. Because it's, it's a lot. Mm-hmm. And it's difficult. Mm-hmm. And honestly, it can be like a roller coaster. Mm-hmm. Um, yeah. As you go through those emotions. So. Yeah. That's, um, that's one of those things that, uh, you know, we have talked to several people.

[00:25:03] And, you know, going back to the kids and how they're affected. And we've talked to several people, you know, just in general throughout the years. And, uh, you know, we've heard people say, well, we stayed together for the kids. And, you know, which is not a good idea because nine times out of 10, when they do, they try to stay together for the kids. And then the kids, when they, um, and we've heard the situation where they break it down to the kids and the kids are like. Yeah. Y'all should have done that long time. Yeah.

[00:25:33] You're shocked. Like. Yeah. So excited. So it's, it's, it's just amazing thinking about, um, and as, and we know some people that definitely should have broken up a long time ago. Yeah. And, you know, from the outside looking in, you're always like, well, I, I agreed on a long time ago, but, you know, you, we got to think about what that individual was going through.

[00:26:01] So, yes, there's a process of, they're not going to be in that relationship, but, you know, they're used to coming home to this person. Now there's no one to come home to. They're used to, regardless of what the situation was, he was there or she was there and now they're not going to be there and have to adjust to life. It's almost like, uh, just someone that you've lost, you know? Yeah. It is. It's a type of. Yeah. For sure.

[00:26:31] And honestly, like I did that. Like I stayed for years. Mm hmm. Um, for the kids and, you know, I get asked this question by clients and I can't, I can't answer it. Right. Like, should I stay or should I go? Like, I can't help you with that. Right. Um, we can talk around it. Right. We can talk about pros and cons and all those things, but I can't make that decision for you.

[00:27:01] But what I can tell you is the moment that I finally made the decision. For me, the moment I finally made the decision was the question that popped into my head. What would you tell the girls if they came home and told you that this was the relationship that they were in? Wow. And from that moment forward, I knew exactly what needed to happen. Mm hmm. So I share that question. Right. I share that question with clients. Yes.

[00:27:30] I can't make the decision for you, but that might be helpful for you. Right. I like that. I, I think that in the day in, day out life is happening. And if there's no outward conflict, people think, you know, it's fine, but kids know and they feel the tension and they sense it.

[00:27:54] And to be constantly in an environment where you just, you feel it, it's, it's just not, it's not the best situation. And you're also teaching your kids that that's what a relationship should look like. Right. Right. And so that was a big fear that I had as well was this is what they're learning is. Mm hmm. And then to have girls to. Yeah. To see that, that makes. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:28:24] So for me, that helped me make my decision. Right. In that I didn't want the girls to be in that relationship. Mm hmm. Um, ever. I think it's, it's important to, we've, we've done a few episodes. Like I said, we talked about the divorce statistics and things like that. And I think it's important for people to understand that, you know, we're, we're. Advocating for happy, healthy marriages, but divorce is an option.

[00:28:53] And if you have two people that are, are not in a healthy situation or they're in a situation that they feel that they both mutually feel like it's no longer serving them, that it's okay. Um, I just, I hate for kids to go. I, I just saw a post where an adult, a grown woman, she was devastated.

[00:29:16] She said her, um, mom just told her that her dad and her stayed together for as long as they did because of her. And they, they're now divorced. Well, for one, I thought, why would you tell your kid that? But, um, but that aside. That aside. So now this, this grown woman is devastated because she feels guilt that she was the reason

[00:29:45] that they were together in a situation that they didn't want to be in. But then once this clears, I'm sure she's going to start thinking back because if they were together, didn't want to be, there had to be signs. And so I'm sure now she's, well, you know, once she processes it, she's going to have to go back and rethink those things. Why would you tell? Anyways, that was, why would you tell your kid that? You know, that one time we went on vacation separately. Right.

[00:30:15] When I was 13. Right. She's going to go back through everything now. But the, the, um, one, the, I think it was her, um, Dr. Becky, she said marriage is for adults. And when she said that, that's what I did. It is for adults. And I said, that sounds so simple and well, duh, but no, listen to it because some of, some of these people are just, they're just grown. They're not adults.

[00:30:44] Or Paige. I used to think that all, any marriage was reconcilable other than abuse. But I realized that, you know, if you have one partner that is willing to do work and one partner is not, they're stuck in their ways, then you kind of have to make a decision like, okay, how long do I want to deal with this? You know, if I don't see change in X amount of time, how long do I want to deal with this?

[00:31:12] How much longer do I want to, uh, to further this? Absolutely. Very important for people to think about. Yeah. That was in the, in our program, it's individual and relationship coaching. And, um, the idea of one person going to coaching and, and making changes and then that kind of spilling over. And I like that.

[00:31:40] And I think that is a start, but we've also spoken to a therapist, a marriage therapist who said, um, she'll see clients. I think she said once or twice without their spouse. Yeah. And she said, after that, it, it has to be the both of you. And I, I asked her, I said, well, how do you, you know, what do you do? How do you tell someone I'm not going to see you again? What are they supposed to say to their spouse? Yeah.

[00:32:09] And what she said was, she said, if our marriage is worth saving, you'll go. Yeah. And I was like, well, yeah, I guess. I mean, and that's what it comes down to. If, if one partner sees a need, then the other partner, I might not see it, but if you see it, I need to, I need to be with you to see what we can do. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting that you say that because for me, that was actually,

[00:32:38] a critical turning point in my relationship. So I had asked years ago, like, can we go to marriage counseling? Because I felt that we really needed it. Right. And when that was shot down, and no, we're not there yet. For me, it was like a door closing. Yeah. Right.

[00:33:02] Like, I felt like my feelings didn't matter. Mm-hmm. And that my experience wasn't enough. Right. Right. And my opinion didn't matter enough. And how I felt didn't matter enough. For it to be important to go do something about. Right. And so for me, like, that's a critical point.

[00:33:30] So if your spouse ever asks you or your partner or whatever to get help in your relationship. Yeah. Right. If you want to keep that relationship. Right. Go do it. Right. Exactly. Right. He did. Right? He did. Yeah. And that's the thing. If you're in it, if you're committed to it, then you're, like I said, you'll go and see

[00:33:57] and give your partner that opportunity to have that space and discuss what's going on. And I think, too, that, you know, I know for me, coming from a more structured background, more structured family dynamic, not to say that it was all that in a bag of chips, but having a little bit more structure, I still witnessed a lot of trauma that I didn't realize

[00:34:25] until I actually got into those therapeutic walls, I was like, well, dang, maybe that did affect me like that. You know? And sometimes even, like, with her going to therapy and just her talking to me about some of the things that came up during her sessions, I'm like, man, well, maybe, well, maybe that is. I don't know how it's fierce to say anything. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I haven't been screwed up. As what?

[00:34:59] Yes, you did. One of the things that I love about what we just talked about as well is we're talking, we're coaches, right? And we're talking about therapy. And I think it's a common misconception that it's one or the other and they don't work together and or, like, you might be against one or the other. And that's not the case at all.

[00:35:28] And so I feel like that's a, you know, a myth to debunk. Right. Right. And that's, like I said, as we've gone through this, the coaching part, the strategies, the dealing with now and in what we're creating is one thing. But to go back, I had to get some of those things so that I wasn't as crazy.

[00:35:57] So I could clear some of my crazy. And it's been an eye-opening thing, but it's been hard also. And I have been lucky to have a therapist who's also a coach. And so within sessions, I get the therapeutic end, but then I also get tools and strategies.

[00:36:22] And I've gotten to a point where, depending on how my previous session went, when I see an email that says bonus note, I'm like, oh, gosh, what now? But I've gotten those things. So I'm thankful of that. And like you said, there's a place in need for both. So I'm glad that you brought that point up.

[00:36:48] Before we close out, I do want to bring up, talk about the coaching, co-parenting after divorce is done. How do you help your clients maneuver through those issues? Yeah. So I do that in two ways. Um, so one is through divorce coaching.

[00:37:11] So I can work with individual clients on how they show up, how they respond to their co-parent, how like tools to help them regulate and give them really good options as to how they can help themselves in the moments when they're feeling very reactive.

[00:37:33] Um, and ultimately working them down a path of deescalation with their co-parent and really just focusing on the needs of the child. And then the other element for me is also parenting coordination. So that's actually working with a couple and it's court ordered for high conflict co-parents. Um, they can have, uh, the court order them to go to parenting coordination.

[00:37:58] And what that does is then I would serve as a third party to help them together to deescalate the conflict between them. And then to also help them focus on the needs of the child, because it's so easy for people to get caught up in the emotion and the weeds and the, he said, she said all the things, right? You can just imagine.

[00:38:25] And how do we keep that out as much as possible and help ensure that the child or children are the focus? Yes. Yeah. So, and for me, I learned so much going through the training. Like I'd already, you know, done the mediation. I've already gone through the coaching training, but for me going through the parenting coordination training was also really helpful. And I had to listen to it twice.

[00:38:49] I had to listen to the training once from a personal perspective, right? Being a, a co-parent in a high conflict co-parenting situation. And then I had to listen to it from a second time from the, the lens of, um, a professional helping someone else. But I had to process and listen to it from my experience first.

[00:39:15] And then I could listen to it from the perspective of a provider. I did not expect that. Yes. So going through those, that experience, has it changed how you now show up with, in your situation? Yeah, absolutely. Um, I feel like it helped me a lot. It helped me to better understand. And I feel like there's levels of understanding that you go through.

[00:39:45] So for me, I think this is a really good example too. My, my therapist at the time would tell me like, you need to not like, let this take up free rent space in your head. Okay, cool. I don't know how to do that. Right. How? Right. I do not know how to do that. Right. Someone please help me. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Um, and that's one of the biggest struggles that I had was like, we could talk through

[00:40:13] things in therapy, but then I'm like, okay, but how do I do that? Right. And the, how do I do that came through in the divorce coaching. It came through in taking the training for parenting coordination, like actually giving me more tools to help myself. And I love that I have those now because I can help other people who are going through

[00:40:38] the same things and maybe they don't have to get to that high level of conflict or escalation or be in court all the time. Right. Even just having those things. So I can help people either through coaching separately outside of the court system, um, from the beginning or to help them prepare for all of the steps up to and including finishing out their divorce and then just managing day to day with their co-parent. Right.

[00:41:05] Um, or I can do it through the court ordered process where I would be a third party that would come in and help them to do those steps right together. Um, focusing on the kiddo and then obviously reporting back to the court and all the fun things that come along with that. So if you had to, um, tell listeners the three most important things, uh, that, that we've

[00:41:35] talked about, or if there's something we didn't get to, but three most important things they need to know if they're in, um, a situation where they, they need to lessen the conflict and increase the connection. What would those three things be? Um, I think the first thing is that they're not alone. Um, they're not alone. There are so many people that feel the same way as they do.

[00:42:00] I can't tell you, um, every situation I feel like that people bring to me is different, but some of the underlying like causes are exactly the same. And so just knowing you're not alone, um, I think is really important. I think it's also really important for people to know that how they feel makes sense. Um, we've all been through a lot.

[00:42:22] We've all had life experiences that may differ from others and our experiences are valid. And no one should try to take those away from us. Um, let's try and improve the circumstances and situation, but the way that you feel makes sense. So I think that's really important. And then the third thing I think that's important is getting curious with one another.

[00:42:52] It's so easy to keep things high level. And for me, that was a conflict avoidance, um, tactic in the past, right? I was very agreeable. Um, I didn't dig in. I didn't have, I feel like for a long time, I may have just had surface level relationships, to be honest. And that's really hard to say.

[00:43:21] Um, but being able to get genuinely curious with someone better understanding, understand their viewpoint, what drives them, what, you know, keeps them up at night, what worries them, um, all of the things that make us who we are, like just giving someone an opportunity to share those things. I think is really important. That's fantastic.

[00:43:49] So Jennifer, um, for our listeners who heard a nugget of wisdom or a jewel or want to reach out to you and talk to you some more about the services you provide, uh, can you give us the information to get in contact with you? Yeah, absolutely. Um, they could visit my website, enduring ca.com or I'm, I feel like I'm all over social media.

[00:44:17] Um, so Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, TikTok, YouTube, all the places. We proud of you, girl. We are. We're excited for you. We feel like we taught you ourselves, but I know we did. Whatever. Um, just knowing your, um, your journey and where you are and how important what you're doing is to you is it's good to see when your face pops up.

[00:44:46] To see your, um, I, I, not that you look bad then, but I mean to see you now. Sorry. And the last time we saw each other, I can tell that. The, the excitement and whatnot because yes. Yes. Okay. Oh my goodness. We got to work on. It's okay. Last time. Do you have a coaching opportunity?

[00:45:14] Say you look like a hager in a day. I know exactly what he means because, and you and I have, have spoken, seen each other. A few times since he has, but you have, you have an excitement and a glow that's there. And when last we were together and we talked to you, um, it was still at the, the, you

[00:45:43] haven't, you hadn't fully delve into your business and all those things. So there was confusion. There was, you know, other things. So much anxiety. So much anxiety. And now that's gone, right? It's not necessarily gone, but. Yeah. That's what I'm talking about. Well, man, my girl just, she's, she took, she took off. Yeah.

[00:46:11] She, she has, she's put in a lot of work and she has a lot of passion for what she does. So we're excited for her. Thankful that she came and shared with us. Yeah. And, um, the transparency, you know, talking about her experience and going through her divorce and everything. And that was just, you know, sometimes you have to go there to really get the point across and let people know that you had, you do understand them.

[00:46:37] So, so we'll make sure and, uh, leave all of her contact information so that you can get in contact with her. If you heard something that connected with you. Yep. If you need a divorce coach, she is the one for you. I don't know about divorce culture, but until next time. We go. Holler at y'all.